视频库 / NO.032ASK THE BEST MINDS THE BIG QUESTIONS一人,一实验室
视频库 / NO.032
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第 32 期

The illusion of consciousness | Dan Dennett

节目发布 2007-05-03
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0:04 哲学家谈意识为何遭人白眼 ▶ 正在看
1:40 人人自认是意识专家的错觉 ▶ 正在看
2:44 意识流插画与百万亿细胞机器人 ▶ 正在看
4:37 真魔术的悖论:意识是一袋把戏 ▶ 正在看
5:53 哲学家如何解释锯人魔术 ▶ 正在看
7:43 方块变色演示:大改变也看不见 ▶ 正在看
9:48 眼球跳动与中央凹的低分辨率真相 ▶ 正在看
10:25 贝洛托画中的颜料斑点与大脑补全 ▶ 正在看
12:22 大脑不填细节,只让你以为有细节 ▶ 正在看
13:06 心理旋转实验:你不知道自己怎么做的 ▶ 正在看
14:22 内克尔立方体的四种看法与主观轮廓 ▶ 正在看
16:56 变化盲视实验:屋顶、阴影与引擎 ▶ 正在看
20:01 第三人称科学与自上而下的心智理论 ▶ 正在看
01哲学家谈意识为何遭人白眼
0:04
So I'm going to speak about a problem that I have and that's that I'm a philosopher. (Laughter) When I go to a party and people ask me what do I do and I say, "I'm a professor," their eyes glaze over. When I go to an academic cocktail party and there are all the professors around, they ask me what field I'm in and I say, "philosophy" -- their eyes glaze over. (Laughter) When I go to a philosopher's party (Laughter) and they ask me what I work on and I say, "consciousness," their eyes don't glaze over -- their lips curl into a snarl.
所以我要讲一个我自己的问题,那就是——我是个哲学家。(笑声)我去参加派对,别人问我是做什么的,我说“我是教授”,他们的眼神就开始发直了。我去参加学术界的鸡尾酒会,周围全是教授,他们问我是哪个领域的,我说“哲学”——他们的眼神也开始发直。(笑声)等我去参加哲学家的聚会(笑声),他们问我研究什么,我说“意识”,这下他们的眼神不发直了——他们的嘴角开始撇起来,露出鄙夷的表情。
便签笔记
0:46
(Laughter) And I get hoots of derision and cackles and growls because they think, "That's impossible! You can't explain consciousness." The very chutzpah of somebody thinking that you could explain consciousness is just out of the question. My late, lamented friend Bob Nozick, a fine philosopher, in one of his books, "Philosophical Explanations," is commenting on the ethos of philosophy -- the way philosophers go about their business. And he says, you know, "Philosophers love rational argument." And he says, "It seems as if the ideal argument for most philosophers is you give your audience the premises and then you give them the inferences and the conclusion, and if they don't accept the conclusion, they die.
(笑声)我会收到一片嘘声、怪笑和低吼,因为他们心想:“那不可能!意识是解释不了的。”居然有人觉得自己能解释意识,这种厚脸皮简直是荒唐透顶。我已故的、令人怀念的朋友鲍勃·诺齐克,一位出色的哲学家,在他的一本书《哲学解释》中,评论了哲学这门学科的风气——哲学家们做事的方式。他说,你知道,“哲学家热爱理性论证。”他还说:“对大多数哲学家来说,理想的论证似乎是这样的:你先给听众你的前提,再给他们推理过程和结论,如果他们不接受这个结论,他们就会死。
便签笔记
02人人自认是意识专家的错觉
1:40
Their heads explode." The idea is to have an argument that is so powerful that it knocks out your opponents. But in fact that doesn't change people's minds at all. It's very hard to change people's minds about something like consciousness, and I finally figured out the reason for that. The reason for that is that everybody's an expert on consciousness. We heard the other day that everybody's got a strong opinion about video games. They all have an idea for a video game, even if they're not experts.
他们的脑袋会爆炸。”这个想法就是要有一个强大到能把对手击倒的论证。但事实上,这根本改变不了人们的想法。要改变人们对意识这类问题的看法非常难,而我终于弄明白了原因。原因就是:人人都是意识方面的专家。我们前几天听说,每个人对电子游戏都有很强的看法。他们都有做游戏的点子,哪怕他们不是行家。
便签笔记
2:09
But they don't consider themselves experts on video games; they've just got strong opinions. I'm sure that people here who work on, say, climate change and global warming, or on the future of the Internet, encounter people who have very strong opinions about what's going to happen next. But they probably don't think of these opinions as expertise. They're just strongly held opinions. But with regard to consciousness, people seem to think, each of us seems to think, "I am an expert. Simply by being conscious, I know all about this."
但他们不会认为自己是电子游戏专家;他们只是有很强的看法而已。我相信,在座从事气候变化和全球变暖研究,或者研究互联网未来的人,一定遇到过对接下来会发生什么抱有强烈看法的人。但那些人大概不会把这些看法当成专业知识。那只是他们坚定持有的意见罢了。可一说到意识,人们似乎都会觉得,我们每个人似乎都会觉得:“我就是专家。光凭我有意识这一点,我就对这件事了如指掌。”
便签笔记
03意识流插画与百万亿细胞机器人
2:44
And so, you tell them your theory and they say, "No, no, that's not the way consciousness is! No, you've got it all wrong." And they say this with an amazing confidence. And so what I'm going to try to do today is to shake your confidence. Because I know the feeling -- I can feel it myself. I want to shake your confidence that you know your own innermost minds -- that you are, yourselves, authoritative about your own consciousness. That's the order of the day here. Now, this nice picture shows a thought-balloon, a thought-bubble.
所以,你把你的理论讲给他们听,他们会说:“不不不,意识才不是那样的!不对,你全搞错了。”而且他们说这话时带着一种惊人的自信。所以我今天要做的,就是动摇你们的这份自信。因为我懂那种感觉——我自己也能感受到。我想动摇你们的一个信念:你们并不真的了解自己内心最深处——你们对自己的意识并不具有权威。这就是今天要谈的主题。这张漂亮的图上有一个思想气泡、一个想法气球。
便签笔记
3:17
I think everybody understands what that means. That's supposed to exhibit the stream of consciousness. This is my favorite picture of consciousness that's ever been done. It's a Saul Steinberg of course -- it was a New Yorker cover. And this fellow here is looking at the painting by Braque. That reminds him of the word baroque, barrack, bark, poodle, Suzanne R. -- he's off to the races. There's a wonderful stream of consciousness here and if you follow it along, you learn a lot about this man. What I particularly like about this picture, too, is that Steinberg has rendered the guy in this sort of pointillist style.
我想大家都明白它是什么意思。它是用来表现意识流的。这是我见过的关于意识的最喜欢的一幅画。当然是索尔·斯坦伯格画的——它曾是《纽约客》的封面。画里这个人正在看布拉克的一幅画。这让他想到了baroque(巴洛克)这个词,然后是barrack(兵营)、bark(狗叫)、poodle(贵宾犬)、苏珊·R——他的思绪就这么一路飞奔出去了。这里有一段精彩的意识流,如果你顺着它读下去,就会了解到关于这个人的很多事。我尤其喜欢这幅画的另一点是,斯坦伯格是用点彩派那样的笔法画出这个人的。
便签笔记
3:53
Which reminds us, as Rod Brooks was saying yesterday: what we are, what each of us is -- what you are, what I am -- is approximately 100 trillion little cellular robots. That's what we're made of. No other ingredients at all. We're just made of cells, about 100 trillion of them. Not a single one of those cells is conscious; not a single one of those cells knows who you are, or cares. Somehow, we have to explain how when you put together teams, armies, battalions of hundreds of millions of little robotic unconscious cells -- not so different really from a bacterium, each one of them -- the result is this. I mean, just look at it.
这提醒我们,就像罗德·布鲁克斯昨天说的:我们是什么,我们每个人是什么——你是什么,我是什么——大约就是一百万亿个细胞级别的小机器人。这就是我们的组成。没有别的成分。我们就是由细胞构成的,大约一百万亿个。这些细胞里没有一个是有意识的;没有一个细胞知道你是谁,也不在乎。我们必须以某种方式解释:当你把上亿个无意识的小机器人细胞组成团队、军队、营队——而它们每一个其实和一个细菌没什么两样——结果却是这样。你看看这个。
便签笔记
04真魔术的悖论:意识是一袋把戏
4:37
The content -- there's color, there's ideas, there's memories, there's history. And somehow all that content of consciousness is accomplished by the busy activity of those hoards of neurons. How is that possible? Many people just think it isn't possible at all. They think, "No, there can't be any sort of naturalistic explanation of consciousness." This is a lovely book by a friend of mine named Lee Siegel, who's a professor of religion, actually, at the University of Hawaii, and he's an expert magician, and an expert on the street magic of India, which is what this book is about, "Net of Magic."
这些内容——有颜色,有想法,有记忆,有历史。而所有这些意识的内容,竟然是由那成群神经元的忙碌活动完成的。这怎么可能?很多人干脆认为这根本不可能。他们想:“不,意识不可能有任何自然主义的解释。”这是我一位朋友李·西格尔写的一本很棒的书,他其实是夏威夷大学的宗教学教授,同时他是个魔术高手,也是研究印度街头魔术的专家,这本书讲的就是这个,书名叫《魔法之网》。
便签笔记
5:14
And there's a passage in it which I would love to share with you. It speaks so eloquently to the problem. "'I'm writing a book on magic,' I explain, and I'm asked, 'Real magic?' By 'real magic,' people mean miracles, thaumaturgical acts, and supernatural powers. 'No,' I answer. 'Conjuring tricks, not real magic.' 'Real magic,' in other words, refers to the magic that is not real; while the magic that is real, that can actually be done, is not real magic." (Laughter) Now, that's the way a lot of people feel about consciousness.
书里有一段话,我很想和大家分享。它把这个问题说得太精彩了。“‘我在写一本关于魔法的书,’我解释道,然后有人问:‘真正的魔法吗?’人们说‘真正的魔法’,指的是奇迹、法术神通和超自然力量。‘不是,’我回答,‘是变戏法,不是真正的魔法。’换句话说,‘真正的魔法’指的是并不存在的魔法;而真实存在、真的能变出来的魔法,却不是真正的魔法。”(笑声)很多人对意识就是这种感觉。
便签笔记
05哲学家如何解释锯人魔术
5:53
(Laughter) Real consciousness is not a bag of tricks. If you're going to explain this as a bag of tricks, then it's not real consciousness, whatever it is. And, as Marvin said, and as other people have said, "Consciousness is a bag of tricks." This means that a lot of people are just left completely dissatisfied and incredulous when I attempt to explain consciousness. So this is the problem. So I have to do a little bit of the sort of work that a lot of you won't like, for the same reason that you don't like to see a magic trick explained to you.
(笑声)真正的意识不是一堆把戏。如果你要把它解释成一堆把戏,那它就不是真正的意识了,不管它到底是什么。可正如马文说过的,也正如别人说过的:“意识就是一堆把戏。”这意味着,当我试图解释意识时,很多人只会觉得完全不满足、完全不肯相信。问题就在这儿。所以我得做一些你们当中很多人不会喜欢的工作,原因和你们不喜欢别人把魔术的秘密讲给你听是一样的。
便签笔记
6:32
How many of you here, if somebody -- some smart aleck -- starts telling you how a particular magic trick is done, you sort of want to block your ears and say, "No, no, I don't want to know! Don't take the thrill of it away. I'd rather be mystified. Don't tell me the answer." A lot of people feel that way about consciousness, I've discovered. And I'm sorry if I impose some clarity, some understanding on you. You'd better leave now if you don't want to know some of these tricks. But I'm not going to explain it all to you.
在座有多少人,如果有个自作聪明的家伙开始告诉你某个魔术是怎么变的,你会想捂住耳朵说:“别别别,我不想知道!别把那份惊奇夺走。我宁愿一直摸不着头脑。别告诉我答案。”我发现,很多人对意识也是这种感觉。如果我强行给你们带来一些清晰和理解,那我很抱歉。如果你不想知道其中一些把戏,最好现在就离场。不过我也不会把一切都讲给你们听。
便签笔记
7:06
I'm going to do what philosophers do. Here's how a philosopher explains the sawing-the-lady-in-half trick. You know the sawing-the-lady-in-half trick? The philosopher says, "I'm going to explain to you how that's done. You see, the magician doesn't really saw the lady in half." (Laughter) "He merely makes you think that he does." And you say, "Yes, and how does he do that?" He says, "Oh, that's not my department, I'm sorry." (Laughter) So now I'm going to illustrate how philosophers explain consciousness.
我要做哲学家做的事。哲学家是这样解释“把女士锯成两半”这个魔术的。你们知道把女士锯成两半的魔术吧?哲学家说:“我来给你解释这是怎么做到的。你看,魔术师其实并没有真的把那位女士锯成两半。”(笑声)“他只是让你以为他锯了。”你说:“对啊,那他是怎么做到的呢?”他说:“哦,那不归我管,抱歉。”(笑声)所以现在我要给大家演示一下哲学家是怎么解释意识的。
便签笔记
06方块变色演示:大改变也看不见
7:43
But I'm going to try to also show you that consciousness isn't quite as marvelous -- your own consciousness isn't quite as wonderful -- as you may have thought it is. This is something, by the way, that Lee Siegel talks about in his book. He marvels at how he'll do a magic show, and afterwards people will swear they saw him do X, Y, and Z. He never did those things. He didn't even try to do those things. People's memories inflate what they think they saw. And the same is true of consciousness. Now, let's see if this will work. All right. Let's just watch this.
但我也想让你们看到,意识并没有那么神奇——你自己的意识并没有那么了不起——没有你以为的那么了不起。顺便说一句,这也是李·西格尔在他书里谈到的一点。他很惊讶:他表演完一场魔术之后,人们会发誓说亲眼看见他做了X、Y、Z。可他根本没做过那些事。他连试都没试过。人们的记忆会夸大他们自以为看到的东西。意识也是一样。好,看看这个能不能放出来。好的。我们一起看这个。
便签笔记
8:21
Watch it carefully.
仔细看。
便签笔记
8:34
I'm working with a young computer-animator documentarian named Nick Deamer, and this is a little demo that he's done for me, part of a larger project some of you may be interested in. We're looking for a backer. It's a feature-length documentary on consciousness. OK, now, you all saw what changed, right?
我在和一位年轻的电脑动画纪录片作者尼克·迪默合作,这是他为我做的一个小样片,属于一个更大项目的一部分,你们中有些人可能会感兴趣。我们正在找投资人。那是一部关于意识的长篇纪录片。好,大家都看到有什么变了,对吧?
便签笔记
8:58
How many of you noticed that every one of those squares changed color? Every one. I'll just show you by running it again.
有多少人注意到,那些方块每一个都变了颜色?每一个。我再放一遍给你们看。
便签笔记
9:12
Even when you know that they're all going to change color, it's very hard to notice. You have to really concentrate to pick up any of the changes at all. Now, this is an example -- one of many -- of a phenomenon that's now being studied quite a bit. It's one that I predicted in the last page or two of my 1991 book, "Consciousness Explained," where I said if you did experiments of this sort, you'd find that people were unable to pick up really large changes. If there's time at the end, I'll show you the much more dramatic case.
即使你知道它们全都会变色,还是很难注意到。你得非常专注,才能捕捉到哪怕一点点变化。这是一个例子——众多例子之一——这种现象现在被研究得相当多。我在1991年那本《意识的解释》最后一两页里就预言过这一点,我说,如果你做这类实验,就会发现人们没法察觉到真正很大的变化。如果最后还有时间,我会给你们看一个更戏剧性的例子。
便签笔记
07眼球跳动与中央凹的低分辨率真相
9:48
Now, how can it be that there are all those changes going on, and that we're not aware of them? Well, earlier today, Jeff Hawkins mentioned the way your eye saccades, the way your eye moves around three or four times a second. He didn't mention the speed. Your eye is constantly in motion, moving around, looking at eyes, noses, elbows, looking at interesting things in the world. And where your eye isn't looking, you're remarkably impoverished in your vision. That's because the foveal part of your eye, which is the high-resolution part, is only about the size of your thumbnail held at arms length.
那么,怎么会有这么多变化正在发生,而我们却察觉不到呢?今天早些时候,杰夫·霍金斯提到了眼睛的扫视方式,你的眼睛每秒会移动三四次。他没说速度。你的眼睛一直在动,四处移动,看眼睛、看鼻子、看胳膊肘,看世界上有意思的东西。而在你的眼睛没看的地方,你的视觉贫乏得惊人。这是因为眼睛的中央凹部分,也就是高分辨率的那部分,大小只相当于你把手臂伸直时看到的自己的一片指甲盖。
便签笔记
08贝洛托画中的颜料斑点与大脑补全
10:25
That's the detail part. It doesn't seem that way, does it? It doesn't seem that way, but that's the way it is. You're getting in a lot less information than you think. Here's a completely different effect. This is a painting by Bellotto. It's in the museum in North Carolina. Bellotto was a student of Canaletto's. And I love paintings like that -- the painting is actually about as big as it is right here. And I love Canalettos, because Canaletto has this fantastic detail, and you can get right up and see all the details on the painting.
那才是能看清细节的部分。感觉上不像是这样,对吧?感觉上不像,但事实就是如此。你获取的信息比你以为的少得多。这是一个完全不同的效应。这是贝洛托的一幅画。它收藏在北卡罗来纳州的博物馆里。贝洛托是卡纳莱托的学生。我很喜欢这样的画——这幅画的实际尺寸差不多就和现在屏幕上一样大。我喜欢卡纳莱托的画,因为卡纳莱托有那种极其精妙的细节,你可以凑近去看画上所有的细节。
便签笔记
11:01
And I started across the hall in North Carolina, because I thought it was probably a Canaletto, and would have all that in detail. And I noticed that on the bridge there, there's a lot of people -- you can just barely see them walking across the bridge. And I thought as I got closer I would be able to see all the detail of most people, see their clothes, and so forth. And as I got closer and closer, I actually screamed. I yelled out because when I got closer, I found the detail wasn't there at all.
我在北卡罗来纳州那个展厅里朝它走过去,因为我以为那大概是卡纳莱托的作品,会有那样丰富的细节。我注意到那边桥上有很多人——你勉强能看到他们正走过桥。我想,等我走近一点,应该能看清大多数人的所有细节,看清他们的衣服,等等。可当我越走越近时,我真的叫了出来。我喊出了声,因为走近之后,我发现那些细节根本不存在。
便签笔记
11:32
There were just little artfully placed blobs of paint. And as I walked towards the picture, I was expecting detail that wasn't there. The artist had very cleverly suggested people and clothes and wagons and all sorts of things, and my brain had taken the suggestion. You're familiar with a more recent technology, which is -- There, you can get a better view of the blobs. See, when you get close they're really just blobs of paint. You will have seen something like this -- this is the reverse effect.
那儿只有一些巧妙地点上去的小色块。我朝这幅画走过去的时候,一直期待着那些其实并不存在的细节。画家非常巧妙地暗示出了人、衣服、马车和各种各样的东西,而我的大脑接受了这种暗示。你们对一种更晚近的技术并不陌生,就是——喏,这样你能更清楚地看到那些色块。看,凑近了它们真的就只是一块块颜料。你大概见过类似这样的东西——这是反过来的效果。
便签笔记
09大脑不填细节,只让你以为有细节
12:22
I'll just give that to you one more time. Now, what does your brain do when it takes the suggestion? When an artful blob of paint or two, by an artist, suggests a person -- say, one of Marvin Minsky's little society of mind -- do they send little painters out to fill in all the details in your brain somewhere? I don't think so. Not a chance. But then, how on Earth is it done? Well, remember the philosopher's explanation of the lady? It's the same thing. The brain just makes you think that it's got the detail there.
我再给你们看一遍。那么,当你的大脑接受了暗示时,它做了什么?当画家用一两块巧妙的颜料暗示出一个人——比如马文·明斯基那个“心智社会”里的某个小成员——它们会不会派出小画匠,去你大脑里的某个地方把所有细节补齐?我可不这么认为。绝无可能。可那到底是怎么做到的呢?嗯,还记得哲学家对那位女士的解释吗?是同一回事。大脑只是让你以为细节就在那里。
便签笔记
10心理旋转实验:你不知道自己怎么做的
13:06
You think the detail's there, but it isn't there. The brain isn't actually putting the detail in your head at all. It's just making you expect the detail. Let's just do this experiment very quickly. Is the shape on the left the same as the shape on the right, rotated? Yes. How many of you did it by rotating the one on the left in your mind's eye, to see if it matched up with the one on the right? How many of you rotated the one on the right? OK. How do you know that's what you did? (Laughter) There's in fact been a very interesting debate raging for over 20 years in cognitive science -- various experiments started by Roger Shepherd, who measured the angular velocity of rotation of mental images.
你以为细节在那儿,其实并不在。大脑其实根本没有把细节放进你的脑袋里。它只是让你预期会有那些细节。我们来快速做个实验。左边的形状和右边的形状旋转之后是一样的吗?是一样的。你们当中有多少人是在脑海里把左边那个转过来,看它是否和右边那个对得上?又有多少人转的是右边那个?好。你怎么知道自己是这么做的?(笑声)事实上,认知科学界有一场非常有意思的争论,已经持续了二十多年——最早是Roger Shepherd做的一系列实验,他测量了心理意象旋转的角速度。
便签笔记
13:51
Yes, it's possible to do that. But the details of the process are still in significant controversy. And if you read that literature, one of the things that you really have to come to terms with is even when you're the subject in the experiment, you don't know. You don't know how you do it. You just know that you have certain beliefs. And they come in a certain order, at a certain time. And what explains the fact that that's what you think? Well, that's where you have to go backstage and ask the magician.
没错,这是可以测量的。但这个过程的具体细节仍然存在很大争议。如果你读那些文献,有一件事你不得不接受:哪怕你就是实验里的被试,你也不知道。你不知道自己是怎么做到的。你只知道自己有某些想法。而且它们以某种顺序、在某个时刻出现。那么,是什么解释了你会这么想这件事呢?这就得到后台去问问魔术师了。
便签笔记
11内克尔立方体的四种看法与主观轮廓
14:22
This is a figure that I love: Bradley, Petrie, and Dumais. You may think that I've cheated, that I've put a little whiter-than-white boundary there. How many of you see that sort of boundary, with the Necker cube floating in front of the circles? Can you see it? Well, you know, in effect, the boundary's really there, in a certain sense. Your brain is actually computing that boundary, the boundary that goes right there. But now, notice there are two ways of seeing the cube, right? It's a Necker cube.
这是一张我很喜欢的图:Bradley、Petrie和Dumais做的。你可能觉得我作弊了,觉得我在那里加了一道比白还白的边界。你们当中有多少人看到那样一条边界,还有一个内克尔立方体浮在那些圆的前面?看得到吗?嗯,你知道,实际上从某种意义上说,那个边界真的存在。你的大脑其实正在计算那个边界,就是那条正好经过那里的边界。但现在,注意看这个立方体有两种看法,对吧?这是内克尔立方体。
便签笔记
14:57
Everybody can see the two ways of seeing the cube? OK. Can you see the four ways of seeing the cube? Because there's another way of seeing it. If you're seeing it as a cube floating in front of some circles, some black circles, there's another way of seeing it. As a cube, on a black background, as seen through a piece of Swiss cheese. (Laughter) Can you get it? How many of you can't get it? That'll help. (Laughter) Now you can get it. These are two very different phenomena. When you see the cube one way, behind the screen, those boundaries go away.
大家都能看出这个立方体的两种看法吗?好。那你们能看出这个立方体的四种看法吗?因为还有另一种看法。如果你把它看成一个漂浮在一些圆圈前面的立方体,一些黑色的圆圈,那还有另一种看法。把它看成一个在黑色背景上的立方体,透过一片瑞士奶酪看过去。(笑声)你们看出来了吗?有多少人看不出来?举手会有帮助。(笑声)现在你看出来了。这是两种非常不同的现象。当你用第一种方式看这个立方体,也就是在屏幕后面时,那些边界就消失了。
便签笔记
15:41
But there's still a sort of filling in, as we can tell if we look at this. We don't have any trouble seeing the cube, but where does the color change? Does your brain have to send little painters in there? The purple-painters and the green-painters fight over who's going to paint that bit behind the curtain? No. Your brain just lets it go. The brain doesn't need to fill that in.
但仍然有某种填充效应,我们看这个就能看出来。我们毫不费力就能看到这个立方体,但颜色是在哪里变化的呢?难道你的大脑得派些小画匠进去吗?紫色画匠和绿色画匠要争夺谁来画帘子后面那一小块吗?不是的。你的大脑就直接放着不管了。大脑不需要把那部分填充上。
便签笔记
16:07
When I first started talking about the Bradley, Petrie, Dumais example that you just saw -- I'll go back to it, this one -- I said that there was no filling-in behind there. And I supposed that that was just a flat truth, always true. But Rob Van Lier has recently shown that it isn't. Now, if you think you see some pale yellow -- I'll run this a few more times. Look in the gray areas, and see if you seem to see something sort of shadowy moving in there -- yeah, it's amazing. There's nothing there. It's no trick.
当我最初开始讲你们刚才看到的布拉德利、佩特里和杜梅的那个例子时——我回到那张图,就是这个——我说过那后面并没有填充。而我当时以为那就是个板上钉钉的事实,永远成立。但罗布·范利尔最近证明了并非如此。现在,如果你觉得看到了一点淡黄色——我再放几遍。看那些灰色区域,看看你是不是好像看到有某种影影绰绰的东西在那里移动——是的,太神奇了。那里什么都没有。这不是什么把戏。
便签笔记
12变化盲视实验:屋顶、阴影与引擎
16:56
["Failure to Detect Changes in Scenes" slide] This is Ron Rensink's work, which was in some degree inspired by that suggestion right at the end of the book. Let me just pause this for a second if I can. This is change-blindness. What you're going to see is two pictures, one of which is slightly different from the other. You see here the red roof and the gray roof, and in between them there will be a mask, which is just a blank screen, for about a quarter of a second. So you'll see the first picture, then a mask, then the second picture, then a mask.
["未能察觉场景变化"幻灯片] 这是 Ron Rensink 的研究,某种程度上是受了那本书结尾处那个建议的启发。让我先把这个暂停一下。这就是"变化盲视"。你们接下来会看到两张图片,其中一张和另一张略有不同。你们看这里有红色的屋顶和灰色的屋顶,在这两张图之间会有一个遮蔽画面,也就是一块空白屏幕,大约四分之一秒。所以你会先看到第一张图片,然后是空白,然后是第二张图片,再是空白。
便签笔记
17:29
And this will just continue, and your job as the subject is to press the button when you see the change. So, show the original picture for 240 milliseconds. Blank. Show the next picture for 240 milliseconds. Blank. And keep going, until the subject presses the button, saying, "I see the change." So now we're going to be subjects in the experiment. We're going to start easy. Some examples. No trouble there. Can everybody see? All right. Indeed, Rensink's subjects took only a little bit more than a second to press the button.
就这样一直循环下去,而你作为被试的任务,就是在看到变化时按下按钮。那么,先呈现原始图片 240 毫秒。空白。再呈现下一张图片 240 毫秒。空白。如此往复,直到被试按下按钮,说:"我看到变化了。"现在我们就来当这个实验的被试。我们先从简单的开始。几个例子。这个没什么难度。大家都看到了吗?好的。事实上,Rensink 的被试只用了一秒多一点就按下了按钮。
便签笔记
18:24
Can you see that one?
那个你们能看出来吗?
便签笔记
18:33
2.9 seconds.
2.9 秒。
便签笔记
18:42
How many don't see it still? What's on the roof of that barn? (Laughter)
还有多少人没看出来?那个谷仓的屋顶上有什么?(笑声)
便签笔记
18:58
It's easy.
很简单嘛。
便签笔记
19:24
Is it a bridge or a dock?
那是一座桥还是一个码头?
便签笔记
19:30
There are a few more really dramatic ones, and then I'll close. I want you to see a few that are particularly striking. This one because it's so large and yet it's pretty hard to see. Can you see it? Audience: Yes. Dan Dennett: See the shadows going back and forth? Pretty big.
还有几个特别夸张的,然后我就结束。我想让你们看几个特别有意思的例子。这一个,是因为它面积那么大,但还是相当难发现。你们看出来了吗?观众:看到了。Dan Dennett:看到那些来回移动的阴影了吗?挺大一片。
便签笔记
13第三人称科学与自上而下的心智理论
20:01
So 15.5 seconds is the median time for subjects in his experiment there. I love this one. I'll end with this one, just because it's such an obvious and important thing. How many still don't see it? How many still don't see it? How many engines on the wing of that Boeing? (Laughter) Right in the middle of the picture! Thanks very much for your attention. What I wanted to show you is that scientists, using their from-the-outside, third-person methods, can tell you things about your own consciousness that you would never dream of, and that, in fact, you're not the authority on your own consciousness that you think you are.
他那个实验里,被试的中位反应时间是 15.5 秒。我特别喜欢这一个。我就用这个来收尾,因为它实在是又明显又重要。还有多少人没看出来?还有多少人没看出来?那架波音飞机的机翼上有几个发动机?(笑声)就在画面正中间啊!非常感谢大家的关注。我想向你们说明的是,科学家用他们那套从外部出发的、第三人称的方法,能够告诉你关于你自己意识的一些事情,那是你做梦都想不到的,而且事实上,在你自己的意识这件事上,你并不像你以为的那样是权威。
便签笔记
20:49
And we're really making a lot of progress on coming up with a theory of mind. Jeff Hawkins, this morning, was describing his attempt to get theory, and a good, big theory, into the neuroscience. And he's right. This is a problem. Harvard Medical School once -- I was at a talk -- director of the lab said, "In our lab, we have a saying. If you work on one neuron, that's neuroscience. If you work on two neurons, that's psychology." (Laughter) We have to have more theory, and it can come as much from the top down.
我们在建立一套心智理论方面确实取得了很大进展。今天早上,Jeff Hawkins 讲到他试图把理论,一套好的、宏大的理论,引入神经科学。他说得对。这确实是个问题。哈佛医学院曾经——我去听过一场报告——那个实验室的主任说:"在我们实验室有句话。如果你研究一个神经元,那是神经科学。如果你研究两个神经元,那就是心理学了。"(笑声)我们必须要有更多的理论,而且它完全可以是自上而下产生的。
便签笔记
21:28
Thank you very much. (Applause)
非常感谢。(掌声)
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